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Business Referral Explosion with Stacey Brown Randall

April 1, 2020

Generate business referrals without asking.

Stacey Brown Randall is the Founder of StaceyBrownRandall.com.

Stacey specializes in teaching business owners how to build a business by referrals that they don’t ask for which allows them to be more comfortable and authentic in running their business. Her philosophy is: Referrals only come from relationshipsRelationships come from connections. Connections are built through ongoing touch points.

Learn more about how Stacey can help your business develop referrals without asking by listening to this episode of The Thoughtful Entrepreneur above and don’t forget to subscribe on   Apple Podcasts – Stitcher – Spotify –Google Play –Castbox – TuneIn – RSS.

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Welcome to The Thoughtful Entrepreneur Show. I'm Josh Elledge, Founder and CEO of UpMyInfluence.com. We turn entrepreneurs into media celebrities, grow their authority, and help them build partnerships with top influencers. We believe that every person has a unique message that can positively impact the world. stick around to the end of the show, where I'll reveal how you can be our next guest on one of the fastest growing daily inspiration podcasts on the planet in 15 to 20 minutes. Let's go.

On with us right now we've got Stacey Brown Randall, who, full disclosure, I'm a fan of and the reason I'm a fan is because I actually just finished Stacey's audio book and that book is, you're going to want to add this to your queue because it will completely transform your business. And that book is Generating Business Referrals Without Asking: A Simple Five Step Plan to Referral Mastery. Is that what it is? What's that final word there? It's covered on your I was looking at it on your


explosion. I like explosion. And of course, Stacey, you're also the host of roadmap to grow your business podcast and you're found on the web at StaceyBrownRandall.com and that's Stacey with an E. So Stacey, thank you so much for joining us.

Josh. Thanks so much for having me. I'm excited to be here.

So the first thing I want to find out is how you found yourself becoming an expert as it were a sought after expert in the field of generating referrals. Were you just naturally always gifted at people just always wanting to introduce themselves and their friends to you?

And I that would be awesome. If that. That is not the case. I always tell folks, the reason why I have an opportunity to talk about referrals and how we generate referrals without asking is that of sharing necessity and the grace of God. So unfortunately, I had to go through a business failure to realize some things that I wasn't doing well in terms of running a business and learned some really hard lessons during that business failure and had to go get a job after the business failure. So that's when you really know you fail, right is when you actually have to go get a W two job, then started another business started my second business and was like, Okay, I gotta do this different, like, how am I gonna make this different? And I've done some research on best ways to like, grow your business. And I talked to other successful business owners and I looked back What did work within my first business and what didn't work. And what I realized is I've got to touch business development every day. But for me, I got to do it in a way that I'm willing to actually do it, but it also has to work. And one thing I landed on were referrals. And the crazy thing about it is is that I looked back at my first business and I and my first business I was an I was an HR consultant. I had big name clients like KPMG Ally Bank, Coca Cola bottling consolidate, like big name clients. Not one referral. Actually, the only referral my first business ever received was two years later after I had technically shut it down. So not an expert at all. Yeah, I started my second business. I was like, I gotta figure out how to be successful. Like, I have to figure out how this is going to work for me. And I need to grow this business. And I don't want to have another failure. I want more referrals. Like I just actually I just want referrals. And I want to see how I can get a lot of them. So I did what everybody does when it comes to referrals. I researched, I googled, I read books, I listened to sales trainers, and they all told me for the most part, that I needed to ask for them, or I needed to be overly promotional or gimmicky and I needed to pay for them. It was like those are the three common things you just kept hearing. I'm like, No, there's got to be another way. So

I feel like you do where it is. And I think that we're in an age I think particularly today and this is what struck me as I finished your by the time I finished your book is that people today I think we're really savvy when it comes to kind of gauging someone's authenticity and that authenticity means everything we're we protect ourselves from being bombarded or being with ads are being sold to nobody likes being sold to today. And I think we're more sensitive to that than ever before, or we're more sensitive to, oh, they're just shilling for them or something like that. And so because of that, we immediately discount that I just don't know that that's as effective anymore. As opposed to No, this is not an ad like I legitimately really love this service or this person or this product. And, you know, this user generated content and this just organic me, you know, me talking about a brand that I happen to have that you know, experience with me, that's the gold right there that I think every brand wants to create and when you force it. It's just it just isn't isn't that it just it's not authentic and it just doesn't work as well.

Right. And the old school methods of how we have been taught to make referrals happen have always been forced. We've always been taught how to manufacture them or artificially create them. And that's when you think about at the heart of what a referral is, and the human dynamic and psychology around why one happens, like none of that those techniques work. That's why people were uncomfortable asking or if they're, if their whole industry now is against paying for them or they don't want to get overly promotional or gimmicky. You know, the idea is and you said it exactly. People don't want to be sold to they want to buy, but there's two things they want when they buy, right. They don't want to waste their money and they don't want to make a mistake and having somebody else tell you know, I trust him. He can solve your problems. No, I trust her. She's awesome to work with. That is worth its weight in gold.

Wow. Alright, so let's talk because I still I see This all the time. What's the saying? And you even used it in your book. And it is it's cringy. When you hear it, it's like, the greatest things you can give is a referral or something like that.

So you see him you see him a lot of email signatures. Yes. The greatest compliment I can give me as a referral.

No, da,

yeah, right. Right. But the fact that you're asking, it's like, it's like saying, Come on, compliment me, compliment me compliment me it come and tell me how beautiful I am. Like, you wouldn't say that. So why would you say, you know, I mean, I guess it's, you know, they're thinking they're just kind of keeping it Top of Mind or whatever. But then it's like, you know, when it's when we're forced to do that, like, again, you talk about this a lot. It's just awkward when somebody says, Okay, well, I just helped you closed your, you know, refinance your mortgage. Now go and write a list of five people that you that I could talk to you and then you're like, that's so uncomfortable.

I mean, it's the worst and and I think that's the reality, like, the advice that's been out there so long about asking like, hey, like, Let me slide a piece of paper across the table and you tell me 10 people who are just like you should do work with me. Right? Like, like, we've been taught that for so long. And I think people are at the point where they're like, I don't want to do things that are going to make me crazy uncomfortable. I understand running a business puts you out of your comfort zone on some level, right? There's some levels we just don't want to go to. And when we feel uncomfortable, and we can recognize the person sitting across from us, is also uncomfortable. We just don't want to do it. But the worst thing is jaws and this, this is what most people forget. It's not just that we've been taught, hey, you've got to ask or pay, or be overly promotional or gimmicky. We're then also taught and if you won't do those things, well, then you just don't get referrals. And nothing could be further from the truth. But that is yet the advice that we've been peddled for decades and decades

now. Well, we're definitely gonna talk about what works today. But I think I want to go back and make sure that we Really underline just why referrals are the lifeblood of so many businesses. You know, I guess, Stacey, why don't you answer it this way, like, referrals? Like, I'm just gonna buy a bunch more Facebook ads. You know, what would you advise? I guess I guess someone doesn't have to evoke referrals. But what's the danger there? Were they missing out on?

So you're right. Everybody has a number of different ways that they fill their pipeline, right? They fill that prospect pipeline, the funnel, whatever you want to call it, so to speak, right? There's a way that they fill it and I think you should have multiple ways that you fill it right. So if you're, if you're going to do Facebook ads, that's great. If you're gonna do networking, that's great. If you're going to go after earned media and publicity, that's great if you're but referral should always be a piece of that funnel. Now my goal is when the when I work with people is for that to become the biggest piece of the funnel, but I recognize that as well. rounded business, we need more than just one way, right of having our clients come through the door. That's actually you know, that's a little dangerous. Like we need multiple ways. But the idea behind referrals is, and most people will tell you this. And if they don't agree with this, they haven't ever gotten a really good referral before, which is they are typically the easiest to close.

Oh, gosh, yeah,

just right there the quickest to close, they're less price sensitive, because they already assigned value to you, because somebody they know, said, I trust him. And so you should go work with him that automatically assigns value to you. So they don't have as much sticker shot, right, they've already applied that value to you. And they usually move along faster in your sales process, which, let's be honest, we could all use a little help with that these days. And there's this concept that no one buys from you. Like, here's the thing now there's a difference between me buying a pair of shoes on TOMS shoes or Zappos and not needing to talk to anybody. I'm not talking about those kind of businesses. I'm talking about the type of businesses where your clients actually have to know like and trust you before, they're going to decide to do business with you. That's a really important piece. And so but when we do the know, like and trust factor when I'm referred to I drop in at the end of the continuum, on the trust level, right, almost ready to go. And that is what makes referrals the holy grail of always, in my opinion, to generate new business.

Yeah, I mean, especially like for Listen, if you're an agency owner, agencies, if there's one book you read, over the next 30 days, please let it be Stacy's book. I think agencies in particular provide, you know, b2b service providers. This is a no brainer, but of course, the principles work for I think, anybody that's dealing with consumers of any kind, you know, I we have a 1400 dollar a month product, and, you know, the ones that we've gotten several referrals, I guess, in the SEO world, they, for some reason, some, you know, some SEO influencers kind of took a liking to what we do. And so they just like we don't have a partnership with them, you know, we're we're paying them or anything like that. They just they've had really good experience with their service. So they've been referring us to several other people that are into upping their SEO, and you're right 30 minute call, bam, 1400 dollars a month. There. They don't even have to question it. Because someone that they know like to trust a respected said, Yeah, you should definitely talk to Josh. And you're right. I mean, it was like, Oh, my gosh, and I, you know, I caught myself saying, Man, you can't pay for a promotion like this. Well, kind of what we created anything else that you know, in terms of practices that are out there that you wish people would stop doing?

So, you know, obviously, the big one for me is when people ask for referrals, are they that's the only way to generate referrals is asking the other thing though. So that's, of course, my big soapbox. I can all Get on, but I won't. The other one that I find is is that when people confuse where referrals fits into their overall sales strategy, I believe that there are activities that you do in your business that are prospecting in nature, then there are activities you do in your business that are marketing and nature. And then you need a third plan, right, you need a third part of your sales strategy, which is referral in nature. And the reason for this is because who you're speaking to, and the mindset you have when you're conveying those messages behind prospecting, and marketing is completely different than who you're speaking to when you're going after referrals. So, when I'm doing prospecting, whether let's just say use for sake of an argument, networking, right? So when I'm in prospecting mode, and I'm at a networking event, I'm hoping to talk to some prospects, they're going to say yes to having coffee with me to learn about working together later on. Right? Same thing when I'm in marketing mode. I'm hoping somebody lands on my website or sees an ad out there or reads an article that I had placed right for earned media and then Like they see it and they're like, wow, yes, I need that. I need to have a conversation right? in marketing and prospecting, I am speaking for the most part to the end user, the person who will buy for me, right? The person who will hire me, I'm speaking to the prospect, the new prospective client and referral marketing. You don't know who the prospect is, right? So when we're doing we're and I just called it referral marketing didn't mean to, because that's my other pet peeve. But when we're talking about referrals, right with our referral plan, we don't we don't know who the who the prospect is, who we're speaking to, are the people who know the prospects. And so the language, the mindset, how we take care of them, what we do what we say what we don't say, is totally different. So when people try to take referrals, and they slam them into the prospecting side, that's what the asking and paying for methodology comes from. And when they take referrals and they try to slam it into marketing. Well, ultimately, that's where the, oh, just be overly promotional or gimmicky, right, and then the greatest compliment you can give me As a referral and your email signature, that's where those those techniques come from, because we've placed them in the wrong place. And they need to be a separate individual plan process. That's a part of your overall sales strategy.

So Stacey, let's start talking about what does work really well. And I'd like to start off by giving you an example of one product that we have is is kind of more of a one to many type thing where I can't really afford to do individual retail sales on this because of the price point. But we offer a kind of a webinar and we provide a lot of value on the front end. And then we introduce them to a platform where we can increase their authority and it's got over $1,000 worth of services, and then it retails for two payments of 497. So what you know if if our goal and we know a lot of people with a lot of really big audiences Typically, what someone would do is they would say, Okay, well, you've got a big audience. And so what we'll do is we'll just have you join our affiliate program. And so everybody who signs up will give you an in our case, you know, we're willing to pay up to 50% of that to the partner. But I wonder if that then violate your rules? Like, if you can you have an affiliate program? Or was there a better way to do that? What would be a better way for us to let large audiences of consumers know about that particular service?

Yes, I think this is such a powerful question that you asked. And it's one that most people when I give them, give them my answer. They're like, Oh, okay. Because they expect to be like, No, don't do it. Actually, I think affiliate relationships, strategic partnerships are fine. And in fact, it's very commonplace. And a lot of different industries, particularly in the online space, like my programs and online program as well where I help people and of course, I have affiliates who do that the difference that is from when I talk about don't pay the difference between an affiliate relationship. And there's other industries like in the real estate industry, there's always like, hey, if I refer you to another realtor, right, then I'm going to get some of that commission. The difference between affiliate relationships and those, like the real estate industry and other industries is, as the buyer, as the consumer, I know that going into it. I know before I click on your Buy button, that's so and so's an affiliate of yours is going to be compensated for bringing me to your webinar. I'm a an informed buyer, I'm very clear unless I just didn't pay attention. And that's my own fault. I'm very clear on the relationship here. Nothing's hidden. Right? When people have these, and I see this lot in industries that are aren't like real estate, online businesses and things like or even like, technology based companies. It's like when you walk into like, the home builder or the interior designer, right and you're trying to decide or maybe it's your will, it's it's not typically in the financial world because there's huge regulations and compliance around them. But it's like, you know, when you're talking to like that interior designer uses an Example. And that person's like, hey, if you refer, I'm going to refer a bunch of business to you, but I'm going to need a kickback on it. Put yourself in that prospect shoes for just a minute that prospect thinks you're referring them to the best interior designer? How would they feel to find out? No, actually, in fact, I just referred you to the person who's giving me the biggest Commission on what you purchased. Right. That's the issue. It's the behind the scenes, it's the things that aren't disclosed that I have huge issues with affiliate relationships, but I don't call them referrals. That's the other thing that drives me crazy about affiliates. I always tell my affiliates, you're not referring me. Because when you refer me you do you put your trust on the line, and you refer me with nothing expected in return, right? This is a lead that's coming into an affiliate relationship, and that's great and that affiliate better believe in me, or why would you even be associated with me, but it is a different relationship.

Okay, I like it. So if I'm a business owner, and I want to evoke a lot of referrals, what are the steps that I need to be doing.

Yes. Okay. So disclosure first is I'm going to teach you the five steps that you need to follow to be able to generate referrals. But I'm going to make an assumption first, and it's a pretty big assumption I'm going to be making on your behalf, which is for anyone listening, I'm assuming your referral. Alright, so I'm going to pick up these steps prior to anything else we would talk about around creating a sticky client experience, and being referral. And the idea here is, is that I'm assuming you do great work. I'm assuming you're worth talking about. I'm assuming that people want to share you with other people. Like they may not do it all the time, because they're not built that way, which we'll talk about how to get them to do it. Right. But it's that idea that your referral, because I truly believe in my underlying philosophy has always been this is that we all if we do great work, and we have a great client experience, that we then deserve referrals. We're just not owed any of them, which means we need to do a little bit of work. So keep in mind if you've never received a referral, don't start With these five steps, you got to go back and work on your client experience and then develop people into referral sources. You gotta go like step zero and step negative one, right? But we're going to start with step one, and I'm going to make the assumption that you do receive referrals. There, there may not be many, right? You may only have like two or three year or maybe you've got like, 10 a year, maybe more than that, but you know, you're capable of more. So you're receiving some referrals. So the very first step I need you to do is I need you to identify who are your referral sources. So in the book, chapter eight is going to walk you through how to do this, like how far back do you go? And do I can I use my CRM? If I have it? Yes, please, it'll make this process easier. It walks you through what to do if you don't have this information tracked anywhere. And it will give you some amazing data about your business. But ultimately, what you're going to do is look back at your clients and where they came from, and then hone in on the ones that were actually referred to you and so you'll have the clients name and the name of the referral source. What I'm ultimately after to complete step one, is that you actually have this list of referrals. sources. And I always say to folks, and it's kind of a joke, but I mean it. A referral source has a first name, and a last name, not that guy from my BMI group, right? Or where that Sally person that I met four times, right? It's they've a first name and a last name unless Madonna is referring you, right? I need your referral sources have first name in less than you need to know who they are. And that is critical. And that really is a hard first step. And most people are like, Stacey, wait, that's in your paid program. That's how to do it. And then you also give it away in your book, and then I talked about it openly everywhere. And people are like, Why do you talk about something that's behind a paywall? And I'm like, because ultimately, I know, if you can't get past this step, the rest of what I teach you isn't gonna matter. Because everybody's like, just tell me what to do. I'm like, you're asking the wrong question. It's not about what you do. It's about who you're doing it for. And once we know who those people are, who are the people who are inclined to refer you or should be referring you, once we've identified those people, then we can build something that will really resonate with them. And that is important step and it has to go in order.

Nice, nice and next steps. And would you do you have a couple more minutes or you do you have a hard stop in two minutes? No, I'm good. Okay, good. Good. Good. Please, please continue on.

I can talk about this stuff forever. Yeah, he may have to shut me off at the end. Right. Okay. So the idea here is, is once I knew who my referral sources are, step two, most people are like, this is totally out of place. And like, I know it feels out of place. But let me remind everyone what we're ultimately after here. People who drop a brand new client into your lap, you should love them. I mean, like deep down at your core, you should love the people. And I mean love in a very professional sense, not in an inappropriate sense. But you should really care about the people who hand you a new client. You don't have a lot. You don't have to do a lot of work for him. Right like ultimately, when someone's referred to me like they did all the work. I just have to close them their mind to lose and I should be willing and want should feel thankful and should want to take care of the people who are actually referring people to me. So the whole process is built on this idea that you actually feel grateful for the people who are referring you, like you believe that they deserve to be taken care of. So step two is, is that you always have to have an immediate and I mean immediate, like not seven days later, like 24, 48 hours and immediate follow up process to how you think someone when they do refer you now here's the thing. I can't just send thank you notes every time someone refers me and expect them to send me 20 more. That's not how a referral explosion works. But if I can create the concept within myself to sit down and write myself, not my virtual assistant or somebody on my team, and here, write a thank you note and say thank you for referring me to Josh, right, if I can do that, and I can set that gratitude in place. When the referral source receives it. That is ultimately what they want is the acknowledgement of what they did. They didn't do it for you. They did it to help their friend who needs you, but they like to be acknowledged by you. And a lot of people will tell me, they're annoyed when they're not thanked, but like, how do you not acknowledge it? I just dropped a new client into your lap. Like if I had a visor that I worked with, and he was like, I followed your process, I got a referral for a client worth $7 million. I'm like, yeah, how do you not think for that? Crazy, right? And so it sets the gratitude place. Like, it sets it your heart in the right place. Yeah, it also doesn't mean your referral source needs is that acknowledgement, like, oh, wow, that's really cool. Josh, this thing to me or Oh, wow, cc remembered and she sent me a thank you note. That's really nice. It's what you do every time you receive a referral. But Step three, is what we have to do in between being able to write those thank you notes. We have to make sure that we are being memorable and meaningful that we are taking care of our referral sources and that we are ultimately staying Top of Mind with them not keeping in touch, but Top of Mind with them. So they feel like wow, Josh really cares about me and he continuously shows me not only Like every month shows me because that's weird and stalkers, but like just you know, a handful of times a year, like he's taking time to remember me and to thank me for what I need to his business. And that creates, right this desire to like, wow, when you take care of me typically the way we were designed and built is for me to want to see how I can help and take care of you. So when when we're doing this plan, right, this outreach plan to our referral sources that's taking care of them memorable and meaningful, and of course, is keeping us Top of Mind, we're going to weave in step four, which is the language we're going to use and the referral seeds we're going to plant which will ultimately have people know, Oh, right. There's like this thing that we're cut, let's be honest, there's a thing we're kind of ultimately after here, but it comes from a place of being grateful and having gratitude for these folks. But using some referrals, it's just to remind them of why we're so grateful. And the gratitude we have and the continuous use of the referral seeds. Subconsciously gets them thinking about you from a referral perspective, but it still comes from a very, very positive place that's a real place that's full of gratitude and gratefulness. I tell people all the time, if you only worry about yourself or your debt inside, what I teach is not going to work for you, that you actually have to care about people and you have to be willing to show it. And I don't mean you have to send them a bunch of gifts, right? Most people don't have that kind of budget, right? But you do have to be willing to invest in them, whether it's time with them, maybe it's a gift, maybe it's a handwritten card, but a handful of times throughout the year, they have to feel it from you, which means you have to do some little outreach or touch points.

I, I am a big fan of sending videos via email. So you know, they know it's me they can see me I'm talking directly one on one to them. Like and and I express my gratitude and they hopefully they can feel my appreciation love, they can see it on my face. They can feel my energy, like and I talked directly to them. And I'm not sure if that's the best thing to do, but I know it really works for me. I'm really bad at writing no cartel. Like, note cards and stuff like that.

You're gonna have to get better. Josh, you've I've gotten some of your videos. So they are they do come from the heart and they're great. I think videos work great from a buyer's journey perspective, when someone's making the decision that they want to work with you. It's also a great way to just check in and see how they're doing. So I think videos are awesome. But there is something that a handwritten thank you card conveys that nothing else can. So I would always say handwritten cards are like the holy grail videos are next. Don't you dare send an email or a text like that is the lazy man or lazy woman's way out of it. And just don't do it. Like one of the other ways. But that handwritten card is special. But the truth is, like when a new student joins my program, I used to send a handwritten thank you cards and that you know now we're in seven different countries, with business owners in the program. It gets a little much, and I can't believe I'm saying that but it's true. So now I send videos but the truth is, most of the people in my program, they'll never meet me. They'll never be there in Australia or they're in Germany, or they're, you know, Canada. They're not here in the United States. And even there Are the United States they'll still never meet me. And so the video piece is really, really nice. But if they were to refer someone to me, they're not getting a video for me. They are going to get a handwritten thank you note. So yeah, way to make it work. So it's scalable within your business.

Hmm. And Stacey, forgive me, I know you had a couple more steps left.

Yep. So we've done step one, which is identify your referral sources, then step two is just make sure you have an immediate follow up process to think when you receive a referral. Step three is to make sure you have a plan of how you're going to take care of these referral sources a handful of times throughout the year, but doing the right things, not just the easy thing, that email newsletter is not going to cut it that's not my plan for is using the right language so that you are planting direct and indirect referral seeds. And then Step five is the step that pulls it all together. Because the reality of it is is that I know every single person I work with, they are busy. They're the business owner, they're busy, sometimes they're married and have families and they have other obligations outside of work. And it's the And it can feel like one more thing to do if we allow it to now here's the thing that's making you money. Like I had one on hold marketing company, we took from an average of 40 referrals a year to 187 in their first year following the program. So trust me, when it starts to work, you're like, I'll do the work. Not a big deal. But I do know, as busy business owners, what we ultimately need is a process. And so Step five is our ability to take what we've built in step three and step four, and then make sure it's part of our workflow and our processes. So we actually accomplish it throughout the year, because this is a wash, rinse, repeat. So I was just on the call with one of my VIP clients the other day, and they're like, Okay, we got to do 2020 plan. I'm like, No, you have it, pull out your 2019 plan that took you from 50 referrals in 2018 to now, you know, over 100 hundred and 15. Right, in 2019. I was like, take that plan. Let's change up what we didn't like. Let's do the same things that worked really well. It's a wash, rinse, repeat model and you keep doing it like I've got an attorney's been following the program for five yours now, right? She's about to start her six year and she keeps doing it. And referrals only grow and grow and grow. So it's a process that you build a business that you can build a part of into your business. But it's not a one hit wonder or it won't work for you.

So someone might be thinking, as they're hearing you go through this is like, Well, wait a minute system. But people aren't referring me right now. I get thanking them. And I'm ready to thank them and I'm ready to thank them really well. But how do I put How do I sow some seeds here? How do I get this going? So that I can start evoking this more and more and I know the answer, but I'd love for you to share that answer.

Yes. And I would tell folks to like I'm going to give you the high level answer but there's there's two podcast episodes. I think it's I did it early on when I was starting my podcast I think it's episode six and seven of what to do when you need more referral sources. There's an entire article on my website that talks about this too. But the idea here is is that if you're not receiving referrals and you want to and you know it's not because you do choppy or what I call crappy work, thank you know, you deserve them. People say you're awesome to work with, but it doesn't like turn into anything else from that point. Yeah, first thing we need to do is you need to identify who's who would be what I call your soon to be referral sources. And then we follow a process where we're really just building a relationship with them. But this relationship has nothing to do with us, and everything to do with them as to potentially see how we can help them. And then the more you help somebody, right, you kind of build that feeling back to you is like, hey, like, you're really helpful for me. And now I remember you, I think about you, and when opportunities present themselves, they will refer you. And then once they refer you, you just drop them into this plan that you build what you have referral sources that you can execute on your referral plan with as well. So it starts with the identification of Who are those people and I talked about some easy ways to do that in the episode and in the article. And then of course, there's the now what do I do that I've identified them, it's like now take care of them and expect this process to go a little slow, and that's okay. It's okay because when they turn into referral source, that's like my financial advisor. In New York City to drop the $7 million client into your lap, you'll be okay. With it being a little slow, or if they're dropping five or six referrals into your lap, and two years ago, they weren't. It's okay that it takes a little bit of time, but it does build on itself and it does take effect that snowball effect does take effect.

And Stacey, one more thing that I know that you talked about in the book that I think is really, really critical is that you just and we do this a lot in media training. So how do you sell without selling? Well, the simple way? Or how do you get what you want without asking for it in media, is that you just tell stories about it. So, you know, for example, you would tell stories about how you help somebody else. So or in this case, I think, you know, culturally what we want to do is we want to tell stories about the referrals that we're getting and like, Oh my gosh, like I'm getting, you know, thank you so much for all the referrals we got in November, and you would tell us you just like people were just hearing This Oh, okay, so in this community, I guess it's normal to share referrals with Josh. Right. And so like, they just keep hearing like, it's we're normalizing that behavior. And we talk about and we tell stories about it without saying, the greatest gift that you could ever give me would be a referral. You just like, well, I love it. Yeah, you probably would refer someone to me eventually, because that's just what we do around here. So it's like, you make it feel like it's a normal thing for people to do. And then it's like, oh, well, when in Rome, I guess we you know, this is how we all grow and thrive together. And so, so I think rather than like, if you're going to do a video to your tribe, rather than asking for it, just thank people publicly or thank the community for like, Oh my gosh, you know, we have this like, really grassroots thing where like, everybody is like welcoming other people into the community. And so you just like Thinking in advance you use like you're, you're an even if it's not existing in a big way, you're in some way speaking it into existence to. Can you talk about that just a little bit?

Yeah, I mean, so there's one of the things I talk about in the book is this ability to even when you're just having conversations with people, and people say to you, like, hey, how's business? Right? Like, what we all say the same thing. We're all like, it's great. Or maybe, if we're being honest, right, it's not going great. Not for you. And I, of course, but you know, for anybody else. And so like, if we're beat like, we just give this like, Oh, it's great. Thanks for asking, how's it going for you? And it's the same thing you were saying? Like if people referring you Say it, say to your community, thank them for referring them out loud. But also even in our one to one conversations. It's just like when someone says how's business, I would so much prefer if this is true. And you have to figure out how to say this. What's true for you, I give some variations in the book, but because it's not what I'm going to say isn't true for everybody, but it'd be awesome be like, Hey, you know, I just brought in three new clients, and all of them were referred to me It is such an awesome reminder that I do great work when my clients refer other clients. To me, it is amazing. Don't you think referrals are the best way to grow your business? And then see where the conversation goes? Yeah. Right. Like, you don't have to make it about anything about your business because all of a sudden, I hear Oh, people were first AC. That's what I heard from that. Right? I may not remember who I may not remember how many I may not remember what exactly she said. But it's that idea that Oh, yes, Stacy's referred. So it's in lots of places, we can say it. You can overdo it. Right? You can be a little bit Oh, now you're just like you're reaching for something. So there is I always like to teach my growth by referrals. Students like, there is a methodology or a formula to this. And there's a balance to how we want to make it work. I always tell folks, if you feel normal doing it, then you're probably okay. But if you're getting into that, I'm saying it for the 13th time in three days. Yeah, you should probably listen to your gut and not do it again. Um, so there's a way to do it. And there's a formula there's like a mix the balance that really works. But yeah, it's that idea of just when people say, hey, how's business? Tell them how great referrals are. If it's true, you may have to look at it differently, right, depending on your numbers. But there is that idea that and then publicly thank people when they refer you and some businesses can do this better than others because of the industry that they're in. But at the end of the day, you do start having people think about you, the more you tell them how you want them to think about you.

Stacey Brown Randall, I appreciate you. Your website, of course, is StaceyBrownRandall.com. And that's Stacey with an E. One thing that I would recommend, there's two things I want you to like I love finding this value that you can take off of the conversation that you're listening to right now. And there's two things I want you to take advantage of that Stacey offers. Number one is you can take a free assessment, and it's a quiz you can uncover your referral ninja level and then I suspect, Stacey, based on their score, you can probably make some recommend Is that right?

Yes, I'll show them what it wherever they land. I'll show you how you get to the referral ninja master level.

Nice nice and, and one way to help you on your journey would be to pick up Stacey's book which is on Amazon and that's Generating Business Referrals Without Asking: A Simple Five Step Plan to Referral Mastery. And you can actually even just get a chapter for free. By going to Stacey's website. StaceyBrownRandall.com. So, Stacey, thank you so much for everything you've shared with me. Again, this is probably my longest Thoughtful Entrepreneur interview ever. But this was just so critical. Like I truly believe that there are so many sales that are in the future of the person that's listening to our conversation right now, by just creating this culture and truly facilitating an environment where people want to refer people to you. I think 2020 is going to be a very exciting year for those folks.

That is awesome. Thank you so much for having me. I appreciate it. So much.

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