1694 – Discerning What You Stand For with Michelle Vandepas

Josh (00:00:05) - Hey there, thoughtful listener. Would you like consistent and predictable sales activity with no spam and no ads? I'll teach you step by step how to do this, particularly if you're an agency owner, consultant, coach or B2B service provider. What I teach has worked for me for more than 15 years and has helped me create more than $10 million in revenue. Just head to up my influence and watch my free class on how to create endless high ticket sales appointments. You can even chat with me live and I'll see and reply to your messages. Also, don't forget the thoughtful entrepreneur is always looking for guests. Go to up my influence and click on podcast. We'd love to have you. With us right now. It's Michelle Vandepas. Michelle, you're a publisher and your website, you've got a couple of them. Here is Grace Point publishing.com, of course, your personal website, Michelle Vandepas. And you also have another website I think it's Michelle kochs.com right which will kind of redirect folks to all of the above.

Michelle (00:01:20) - That's right that all all roads lead back to me.

Josh (00:01:23) - Josh you are in beautiful Colorado Springs. I was mentioning that's where my daughter lives. As of when we're recording this, I'm going to be out there in about three weeks. My wife and I get out there a couple of times a year. What a beautiful part of the country. How did you just before we kind of get into what you do, tell me about why you like living in Colorado Springs?

Michelle (00:01:44) - Oh.

Michelle (00:01:45) - So I've traveled the world and keep thinking, you know, oh, would like to live here, Would I like to live there? But, you know, there's nothing like home. And I moved here. I'd lived around different places when I was a kid. My husband and I met in Dallas. We came up for vacation and I'm like, This is it. This is where I want to live. That was 40 years ago. Still here. Same house, same husband, same town. Um, and not everything in my life has been so consistent, but that has been and I like it.

Michelle (00:02:16) - And I like to travel and I like to come home.

Josh (00:02:18) - Yeah. Yeah. All right. Well, Michelle, tell us about your impact in the world, the work you do today. I know you're also a well-known speaker in addition to kind of being in the publishing world, but give us an overview of your impact today.

Michelle (00:02:34) - Well, love that. Your impact today. What a great way to ask a question. Right. Um, you know what I like to say that I really do is help people discern what they really stand for and get that message out into the world. That happens to take the form mostly of book coaching and book publishing. Right? But it doesn't have to. I really can dig in with other people and help them really figure out where they want to put their stake in the sand and say, This is what I'm going to write my book about. Because usually first time authors come to the table with a million ideas. And so I would say my impact is really helping other people get super clear.

Michelle (00:03:20) - And then publishing that work usually in the form of a book.

Josh (00:03:25) - You kind of give us a lay of the land for book publishing today?

Michelle (00:03:29) - Oh, man, am I allowed to swear? It's so.

Josh (00:03:34) - Good. Editor, Get your finger on that bleep button because.

Michelle (00:03:38) - Um, you know, it's. It's a crazy thing, right, With most. Um, big or not organic industries. There's some gatekeepers, right? There's. There's gatekeepers in this industry. There's only, like, a couple of ways to really sell books. There's really only a few really big publishers that are going to get you mainstream media. And so the perception is either have to self-publish or have to go with a big publishing company, or I'm going to waste thousands of dollars and not sell any books. So it's like, um. The industry is changing so fast and has changed so fast, nobody really understands what's going on. Right. And that's why I'd like to just talk to people rather than try to explain, because everyone has different questions.

Michelle (00:04:32) - But what I see is that publishing right now is going through a whole nother revamp. People are listening to podcasts more, they're watching videos, more people are still reading. But Josh, my guess is maybe you're not reading as much as you did 20 years ago, like paper books. I mean, I still read but didn't have Netflix 20 years ago. And I gotta say, sometimes I watch Netflix, whereas I used to would have read a book, right? Yeah. And so that's changing how we're viewing books and the purpose of books. And I'm talking non-fiction.

Michelle (00:05:07) - Yeah.

Michelle (00:05:08) - Not, not fiction because fiction everyone loves to read fiction still. So think the landscape's changing. Distribution has to change because there's just like a couple of places where you can really buy books and that controls the marketplace. But what you get to see, I'd like to be part of that disruption. Find new ways to get books into the hands of the people that need them. Yeah.

Josh (00:05:32) - My experience is on the consumer side of this or is, you know, as an avid book consumer, it is to me.

Josh (00:05:40) - I think in the past, I think, you know, you'd pick up a book like E-Myth and it's like your relationship with the author was contained within, you know, kind of like the front cover and the back cover and that was it. And then maybe you'd go and hopefully you would take action on what you read. But there was that was kind of the end of it, right? It's just like you had this kind of imaginary relationship with the author. Whereas today, you know, I'd say my typical cycle with the book, I do this a lot, right? Where I will come across the content. And, you know, again, kind of maybe high level, then maybe I'll listen to a podcast with the author, dig in a little bit more, maybe find some if there's some content on YouTube about it and then I get confirmation. Yeah, this is exactly I am I and then then I want to do the deep dive and for me, the deep dive. Now, ideally I would me, you know, I'd be looking for an audiobook because that's how I how me how I, you know, tend to learn but or an e-book would be fine Kindle or something like that.

Josh (00:06:47) - And then from there, obviously I'm going to get an engaged with the author in some way. I'm going to be following them on social. Of course, by then, you know, I'm looking for additional resources on their website. I feel like I want to build a relationship with them, not just, you know, this superficial where we're kind of separated by just kind of words on a page like, I want to engage, right?

Michelle (00:07:12) - And all that has changed so much. I'm glad you brought that up because you may not even buy a book until you've done all those things first, right? You introduced in a podcast or on a video or on social. You heard about an author and then you buy the book and then you go engage even further. Maybe you buy the book and then you're looking for further information or even validation about who this person is, who this author is, and how do you find the book? Right? That's really as a consumer, how do you find these new books if it's not in the top bestsellers on Amazon or sitting in your bookstore? That doesn't mean it's not a great book.

Michelle (00:07:55) - There's lots of great books out there that aren't necessarily right in your face all the time. And the things you're talking about is exactly how authors need to connect with their future readers and their readers. All these other things that are new that has changed over the years to help bring your audience in and and also will help your second and third book.

Josh (00:08:18) - Well, and herein lies the opportunity, right? So authors that are willing to connect beyond just the book, you know, certainly I think this is pretty well known that, you know, don't expect to get rich on your first book. I mean, or maybe even your second or third book. It's there's a lot of opportunity, particularly in the nonfiction world. Right? You know, beyond that, can you talk maybe about the business model for nonfiction authors today?

Michelle (00:08:48) - Yeah. So you can definitely. So a couple of things. You can definitely get rich off your first book, but it won't be from the sales of the book. It will be from all these other things that you're talking about, right? How do you build your business if you're writing a nonfiction book? There's a couple different reasons to write.

Michelle (00:09:05) - One. One is you have a legacy, you have a story, you have inspiration. Maybe you're building a coaching business around it, maybe or not. You just want to write your book and leave your mark and that's enough. You do that, you sell a few hundred, a few thousand copies, whatever it is, and you've left your mark in the world. And that's beautiful. The other way is what you're talking about. A business model where you actually have a business, maybe it's consulting, maybe it's online products, maybe it's a brick and mortar store, whatever it is, and you want to use that for lead gen, for foundation to help lead people to your courses or your consulting services. And that can be very lucrative as long as you're using the book as part of the foundational pieces that tie it all together. What you're talking about, you engage with the author, you give them maybe free content. As an author, you're on podcasts, maybe you're hosting podcasts. You have really good calls to action in your book.

Michelle (00:10:08) - Your book is structured to lead your reader through a process to help them open up and be ready for the next level of what you're giving, right? So there's a lot of structure that goes in underneath that. And I'm always saying your goal is to get people who want to buy from you from your book if you're using it for that reason. You can sell lots of books. You don't have to sell lots of books to have your book become very successful for you and your business.

Michelle (00:10:45) - Yeah. Yeah.

Josh (00:10:46) - And so for Gracepoint and the work that you do, Michelle, where should the author be or the potential author be a future author be in that journey and you know, what are they going to be expected to do versus what may you? How does gracepoint and how do you help them?

Michelle (00:11:05) - We do it well. We do it all. We have all different divisions. We do ghostwriting. We do book coaching. We will help you at the very beginning. But we also have people who come to us with manuscripts that just need some final editing or just publishing or soup to nuts kind of company.

Michelle (00:11:21) - I've been doing this a long time, so we have all these different divisions plus audio books. We also have people come to us and say, Publish my book now I want the audio book. We have a production studio that does that. The place where I think most authors need the most help, though, is they have a million ideas in their head. They're running a business. They're entrepreneurs. They go a mile a minute. They know that they have something to say. They know this is their next step and they need help discerning what's actually going to go in the book and what's the structure of the book going to be and if if that's where you are. Book a call with me and we'll figure out where you go and what should be in in the book, because I find that less is more in today's marketplace. You don't need to say it all in one book.

Josh (00:12:15) - Yeah. Who would be an author that maybe might not be a great fit for you? And who would be an example of an author would be perfect for you?

Michelle (00:12:27) - Um.

Michelle (00:12:28) - I love working with people who have stories to tell. Um, we're really good at our company about helping pull out the hard stuff people who've been through hard journeys. How do you say that in a way that becomes inspirational rather than just, Oh my gosh, don't want to be that, or they've been through so much, That's not me. How do you make it relatable? We're really good at pulling out people's stories and putting that into a teaching moment in a book. Um, don't do a lot with fiction. Don't do a lot with people who say, I have this book, I'm not going to edit it. It is what it is. Go meet me in New York Times bestseller. Like if if they have very specific goals and dreams and they're on a trajectory that's maybe not collaborative. There are plenty of companies out there that will help those people, right? It's more of a marketing thing than a publishing thing. They like. They have their books. They're ready to go market it.

Michelle (00:13:25) - We like working collaboratively to make the book better, the best book it can be. And that's not always a match for everybody. You think it would be? I would think it would be, but it's not.

Josh (00:13:39) - Your website Grace Point Publishing and Michelle Van Talk actually was it Michelle coaches that was the the redirect website.

Michelle (00:13:50) - Yeah it's easier to spell than paying to pass Michelle.

Josh (00:13:52) - Yes okay Michelle coaches.com did I get that correct.

Michelle (00:13:56) - That's correct. Yeah.

Josh (00:13:57) - Okay great. So someone has been listening to our conversation. What would you recommend? What do they do from here? And they're interested in learning more about you and potentially engaging Easy.

Michelle (00:14:09) - The easiest thing is to book a call with me. I'm not intimidated, and I'll just ask you a bunch of questions. You can ask me a bunch of questions. You know, some people say don't want to book with a publisher. I'm not ready. I'm not ready. But, you know, let's just talk and see where you're at and if it's a match or not.

Michelle (00:14:24) - The other thing that is just a hint is if you're thinking about writing your book and you don't know what it's going to be about yet, write your back cover. Go ahead and write the back cover of your book. This is the first step I often give my clients because it helps get your synopsis. It helps get your thoughts into just one paragraph about what you really want to say. And it may change. Just because you write it doesn't mean it's going to stay. It's going to stick, but it really helps formulate your thoughts quickly and succinctly into one paragraph about what you want your book to be.

Josh (00:14:59) - Yeah, When you're forced to condense it down to that, yeah, you use time to time to boil it down to the essence for sure.

Michelle (00:15:07) - That's right.

Josh (00:15:08) - Well Michelle, again your website Michelle coaches and again if you want to look at the the main gracepoint publishing.com you're welcome to Michelle this has been fantastic. It's been a great conversation and thank you for the good work you do in the world and for the work that you do with great authors.

Josh (00:15:25) - We can make the the world a more positive, engaging place.

Michelle (00:15:29) - I'll see me in.

Michelle (00:15:30) - Colorado.

Michelle (00:15:31) - Springs.

Josh (00:15:31) - All right, Michelle. Looking forward to it. Take care. Thanks for listening to the Thoughtful Entrepreneur Show. If you are a thoughtful business owner or professional who would like to be on this daily program, please visit up My Influence slash guest. If you're a listener, I'd love to shout out your business to our whole audience for free. You can do that by leaving a review on Apple Podcasts or join our listener Facebook group. Just search for the thoughtful entrepreneur and Facebook. I'd love even if you just stopped by to say hi, I'd love to meet you. We believe that every person has a message that can positively impact the world. We love our community who listens and shares our program every day. Together, we are empowering one another as thoughtful entrepreneurs. Hit subscribe so that tomorrow morning. That's right, seven days a week. You are going to be inspired and motivated to succeed. I promise to bring positivity and inspiration to you for around 15 minutes each day.

Josh (00:16:45) - Thanks for listening and thank you for being a part of the thoughtful entrepreneur movement.